Finding Your Perfect Fit: Catherine Cassidy on Celebrating Body Diversity in Fashion

Debra Coleman [00:00:10]:
Hello, and welcome back to another episode of Have A Seat, conversations with women in the workplace podcast. I am your host, Deb Coleman. My friend, are you like me? Has this happened to you? You go to get ready to do you go to open up your closet to get ready, whether it's ready for work or ready to go run errands or go to, like, a party or just hang out with friends. Whatever the case, you stand in front of your closet and you're like, I have nothing to wear. I have nothing to wear. You have a closet full of clothes and shoes and whatnot, but you just stand there staring going, I have nothing. There's nothing here. Whether it's because your tastes have changed, your body has changed, just your overall just what you like anymore has changed.

Debra Coleman [00:00:56]:
But you look at your closet and you're like, I see absolutely nothing. I see nothing to put together. That has that has totally happened to me on more than one occasion. And so my guest this week is here to challenge that assumption, to challenge us. Picture her standing next to you saying, that's not true, Deb. You do. You have a plethora of outfits here and options and choices. You just need to be you just need to maybe reframe how you look at what you wear and what you like.

Debra Coleman [00:01:27]:
And so my guest this week, miss Catherine Kennedy, founder of Boutique Box, is here to help challenge those assumptions we have about ourselves and talk to us in real with a real conversation about fashion and our mindset about our wardrobe and what looks good on us and what makes us feel good. I am thrilled to bring Katherine's conversation with you today. She is a true trailblazer in the fashion industry. With over 20 years of experience, Katherine has worn many hats. From working behind the scenes at fashion week to collaborating with executive teams on strategy and creating the perfect outfits for customers on the sales floor. As the founder and CEO of Boutique Box, Catherine is here to revolutionize the way we approach fashion, focusing on solutions that celebrate our unique styles and needs and showing us the way that sustainability and the fashion industry can work hand in hand. So join me in my conversation with Catherine today. I'm excited to bring this to you.

Debra Coleman [00:02:28]:
It promises to be enlightening and inspiring, especially in the way we view fashion as a country and as an industry. But even at the micro lever micro level of how you view fashion in your life and how you choose and go about choosing the outfits you do every day. So get ready. Grab your favorite beverage. Sit back and relax, and welcome to my conversation with Boutique Box founder, miss Catherine Cassidy. We are sitting down with the wonderful miss Catherine Cassidy, founder and CEO of Boutique Box. And I I am so excited as we chatted briefly before I hit that record button, to talk to Katherine because as somebody who is has the experience she has in the fashion industry to have her here to sort of address our insecurities around fashion and and the ways boutique box addresses those insecurities and works with designers as well as consumers. I just think this is a conversation long overdue.

Debra Coleman [00:03:26]:
So I'm very excited to have Catherine join us today. Thank you, miss Catherine, for having a seat with me

catherine cassidy [00:03:32]:
today. Oh my goodness. Thank you so much for for having me and for this incredible platform that you've built for women to feel like they have, you know, not just a seat at the table, but a support system as they navigate everything. And as I like to say, life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. So I think this is beautiful and brilliant.

Debra Coleman [00:03:51]:
Thank you for that. Absolutely. It has been my pleasure, and I get to meet fabulous women who are just killing it in their space like yourself. So, yes, totally agree. Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Done. Done. We need, like, you know, shout that far and wide for us women, especially.

Debra Coleman [00:04:07]:
Oh my goodness. Well, let's see. Let's let's take it back just a few before we get to the good stuff. Catherine, you mean, your your bio is so impressive. You have been you have over 20 years, I should say, experience in the fashion industry. I, sidebar, am really, really interested too because once upon a time, when I graduated high school and started college, I had envisioned being a fashion merchandiser. I wanted to to be in the fashion industry somehow. I was working retail.

Debra Coleman [00:04:35]:
I was, like, at the mall that I'm dating myself, but, like, working in, like, Macy's and the guest department. You know, I was like, I'm gonna do this all the way. So, obviously, that didn't, work out in the long run, but I still have definite interest and a and a side eye to that whole industry. So I really personally, I'm very excited to have this conversation with you. But with you, you have over 20 years of experience in the fashion industry. So what inspired you to create Boutique Box?

catherine cassidy [00:05:03]:
Absolutely. It is the culmination of what started with my time in retail similar to yours on the sales floor of Nordstrom when I was in college. Ah. And I worked in the individuals department, which is was the department it's changed a lot. That's probably a part of what we'll talk about. But it was at the time the department for women getting dressed for work. So lots of suits and, mix and match pieces to really coordinate a professional wardrobe. And I had a blast with when someone would come into, you know, onto the floor, and I would run around the entire women's department all the through all the departments to find the pieces.

catherine cassidy [00:05:43]:
And that ultimately, you know, as you connect connect the dots backwards is, like, what I'm doing with Boutique Box is, you know, we know the inventory. So it's here are the 5 pieces or the 12 pieces over the course of a year that are perfect for you. But how I got to where I am now was goes back to that time at Nordstrom in the early 2000, which I'm happy to date myself, But, early 2000, so it was just an interesting time economically and also how they operated as a business to learn from, you know, how why that store did so well, why that business did so well. To fast forward a few years later, graduated from college, I actually didn't I went to undergrad for business. I didn't necessarily see myself as potentially going into the fashion industry. I didn't honestly even understand that that that could be my career. What I loved was business and problem solving. And what happened was I took a course, called intro to entrepreneurship, where in the business school, you have to focus your your core emphasis in, you know, 4 classes like finance or as I took entrepreneurship or management of organizations or so when I took that class, it was actually a bit of a risk that I was gonna have to take an extra class if I didn't like this.

catherine cassidy [00:07:00]:
But it ultimately completely changed my trajectory, and that realizing that I could potentially a and I I also didn't get any of the jobs that I was applying for in consulting. I actually really wanted to become a consultant because I felt like I could learn a lot from different businesses and their problems to understand what problem I might wanna solve down the line. So I share that detail because I do think it's important, you know, kinda to your point of, like, you wanted to be in the fashion industry as a merchandiser, and that didn't happen. And, you know, your path took you down a different road. I thought I would be a consultant, and who knows where I would be if I hadn't been rejected. And I happened upon the buyer training programs for, you know, the big department stores, Bloomingdale's, Neiman Marcus, Pacific Sun PacSun was one. I I went to college in LA and then Robinson's May. So

Debra Coleman [00:08:11]:
Oh, yeah.

catherine cassidy [00:08:12]:
Yeah. I also actually got rejected from all of those.

Debra Coleman [00:08:15]:
Oh.

catherine cassidy [00:08:19]:
And to the point where the recruiters for both PacSun, where I did make it to 2nd round interviews, where I did make it to group interviews, I both recruiters for PacSun and Robinson's name were like, I don't understand why you didn't they didn't like, they didn't select you. Because it was a it had to be unanimous, to get that job offer for that management training program in both programs. And so they just I was like, okay. Well, you know, thank you. I appreciate that. Still a bummer. But the Robinsons May recruiter reached out to me, like, a week before graduation, maybe 2 weeks before my graduation with an opportunity for their advertising accounting team.

Debra Coleman [00:09:03]:
Wow.

catherine cassidy [00:09:03]:
And for me, I got happened again, actually not not figuratively, but actually a 100% in accounting. And And so I was like, okay. Sure. You know, it's a foot in the door. And this was when Macy's was going through the had just purchased. They were going through the merger with Macy's. So I figured, well, it's gonna be a short term. It's a foot in the door.

catherine cassidy [00:09:28]:
It's a learning experience. It's a change management case study. There's a theme here of being a nerd that you'll see as we like, I just I love to learn, and I'm a problem solver. And so, you know, I got my foot in the door, it was a great opportunity to learn. And, it also, I was very impressed with how Macy's took care of the people who had been working at Rollins since May for the last 25 years. You know, when people that were this is probably one of the last, you know, generations of having a career at a company, an entire career at a company. So they were having to brush up their resumes, find new jobs. And this

Debra Coleman [00:10:07]:
is a huge change. For me,

catherine cassidy [00:10:07]:
right out of college, it was like, oh, great, I get like all this career fair access to, you know, the fashion industry. I get like all this career fair access to, you know, the fashion industry, all these companies I couldn't get access to before. So too long didn't read. I ended up talking to a recruiter from BCBG where I share a little bit about what I was looking for, and I did my aptitude is for product merchandising. It's a balance of creative and analytical. So when I shared what I was good at and what I was looking for, she immediately said, I have an assistant merchandising job for you. Would you be interested in interviewing? And 2 weeks later, I got the job offer, and I ended up leaving from since May before I could get the severance package because I was like, let's jump on this. Yeah.

catherine cassidy [00:10:58]:
So it was it was Wow. Ended up being about three and a half years in the corporate side of fashion, 2 summers at Nordstrom. At BCBG, it was an incredible learning experience being on the floor, you know, working with the creative director, working with the design team, working with the production team, trying to figure out and analyze the sales, how do we maximize our sales, getting it to be in meetings with the CEO and, you know, BCBG, the the founder is French, and this is where I realized, oh, minoring in French actually was helpful. You know, just I think maybe even just to underscore, like, the things that I did, I did because I enjoyed them. Not because I didn't I minored in French because it was expanding my horizons with a different culture. Not because I thought that I would go work in France or, you know, leverage it in any way that I ended up being able to. And so about a year and a half into my time at BCBG, I was trying to figure out what was next. I was wanting my promotion, And I think this is all especially relevant to your your community because I ultimately was continually having to jump through different hoops and getting feedback that sometimes was helpful and other feedback that was not.

catherine cassidy [00:12:15]:
And I ultimately just realized that I was not gonna get the promotion that I was I thought well deserved because it was now two and a half years into my time at BCBG, and I was burnt out. I was frustrated. I was applying to merchandising jobs at other companies. I was researching other companies to figure out where I could go that, you know, it could be a healthier work environment, and I just did not see a light at the end of the tunnel. And in my role at BCBG, you know, we're analyzing the sales. We're trying to drive strategy. We're trying to drive growth. We're trying to drive, you know, efficiency and profitability or so I thought.

catherine cassidy [00:12:57]:
But, you know, when we saw when I saw that something that was selling through at 6% sell through for 1 week and it was that was a full price sale, so times 4, at the most, 6 weeks where they would be selling that that style at full price. That's, you know, 6 times 4 or 5 is about a 30% sell through. I don't think I'm doing the math quite right, but you get the picture.

Debra Coleman [00:13:23]:
Yeah.

catherine cassidy [00:13:24]:
So if we have a 100 pieces with 30 of them selling at full price, the other 70 percent being sold at markdown, if at all. What does that how does that even make sense for a business to operate, to continue to grow and be profitable? So I did have an inside, you know, look at how all of that worked. And it really ultimately was, we were not in a good financial position, which is why a few years after I left, they did go through bankruptcy. But and that I share even just to underscore, I was 25 when I ended up leaving. And I was like, I'm only 25. What do I know? Well, I was correct. My intuition was correct. I didn't have the data yet or the experience to back it up.

catherine cassidy [00:14:14]:
But intuitively, I knew that it was not right, that it was not a healthy way to drive a business, to grow, to take care of your employees and all of these things. So getting to the point is, I ultimately felt like all of that waste and all of that, you know, essentially overwhelm with all the product in the market. You know, the customer was forgotten, and I didn't see this better at any other company. Nordstrom had shifted a lot even in in those years and how they operated. And and so I saw a massive disconnect between the customer and the designer and a lot of waste in the fashion industry, even just simply from a how is the industry still surviving? How is the industry like, it was a growth at all costs, running on fumes industry, and this was 2,008 when I left. So this is still the case within the fashion industry, except for now people are starting to talk about all of these things that I saw again at 25. I didn't necessarily have the network or the experience to be somebody who could create massive transformational change right at that point. But I did what I could, and I got started in how do I solve the problem for the customer? How do I make it easier for busy, especially professional women, to get dressed for work feeling their best? So that's that's how I got started with with this journey that I've been on for the last 16 years.

Debra Coleman [00:15:48]:
Wow. So it was been recognizing that disconnect that you thought and I'm I'm totally paraphrasing. Hey. Maybe there's something I can do about that. Let me see what Catherine Cassidy can do. Yes. Absolutely. Okay.

Debra Coleman [00:16:03]:
Yeah. Wow. And that's how well, you've you launched your first business in 2008, if I'm not mistaken.

catherine cassidy [00:16:11]:
Yes. Yes. So and Boutique Box, what I'm building now, is a spin off essentially of my first business, YouStyled. Because and the question that drove me forward with every, as I call it, precision pivot, every iteration, every even boutique box became a part of Youstyle back in 2012. I first launched it as a product, under that umbrella because I kept asking, how do I make it easier for women to get dressed feeling their best? How do I make it easier for her to say yes to the

Debra Coleman [00:16:47]:
support? Support, like, from the company?

catherine cassidy [00:16:52]:
Oh, yes. That's a good point. Yeah. But just just to say yes to to getting support, to being supported, to this idea of, you know, we should be doing we have to do it all ourselves or I should just know my style or I should just know where to find things that are gonna fit. I should just, you know there's so much shame for women around style and so that's that's why when I say support, it's like, actually, no, you should not do it all yourself. Or through every transition you move through in life, for every evolution of your career, your body shifting with age or babies, there's this continual relearning. And, you know, who you are at each level in your life and your career is completely different. So the support in in that evolution, the support in how do you find the clothes you love that fit? Like how much time does it take you? And for people who love to shop, time is irrelevant because it's something that they are doing for themselves.

catherine cassidy [00:17:51]:
So, you know, but for those who don't, there's a lot there's a lot wrapped up

Debra Coleman [00:17:56]:
in that. Oh, so much wrapped up in that. So much. I I want to just, quickly reference what you your story about how you just knew. Even though you were young and fairly new to your career path, you knew. Your instincts told you, look. Something isn't right. I'm gonna make a change for myself now because I really strongly suspect I'm right in this.

Debra Coleman [00:18:19]:
And it paid off, like, unfortunately, I'm not, like, celebrating that. But, I mean, I'm celebrating you for knowing it. And I think the message there is you may be new in your career path, maybe listening to this as another, you know, the 22, 25 year old going, gosh. I don't have as much experience. But don't it sounds like the message is don't underestimate yourself. We all have that gut instinct, especially if you're in an industry that, you know, you kind of you want you know, you wanted to be in, it kind of found you, and you're you were, you know, from what it sounds like, you were paying attention. You know, you were aware. You had your 3rd eye open, and you just felt something wasn't right.

Debra Coleman [00:18:54]:
And I just I really applaud you for saying, yes, I was young, but I still knew. And it actually turned out I was right. So I just I I will humble brag for you. I think that's really something because I think we don't give sometimes we don't give our our younger colleagues, like, that kind of a credit or or allow them to sort of explore that or make those maybe mistakes or make those, like, you know, bingo. You got it. Good for you. You know, it's all about, well, you haven't been in this long enough. Well, yes, in some regards, but you know what? Don't discount what I'm feeling.

Debra Coleman [00:19:24]:
So

catherine cassidy [00:19:25]:
Absolutely. Absolutely.

Debra Coleman [00:19:27]:
Yeah. I love that. Wow. So back to fashion. Okay. So I I I love that you spoke to to that whole, like, for women for for women who are shoppers, man, I I am on the sidelines with my bale of popcorn, like, just watching them work. I mean, they are, like, like, in the zone. I have friends who are like that.

Debra Coleman [00:19:46]:
I watch them shop, and I'm just, like, in awe. Because I back in the day, you know, when I I work remotely now, so I'm not as out there anymore. But when I did, I would just walk into a store, like, semi lost. Like, does anybody have a map? I just or I point to a mannequin. That's what I want. You know? And it's just, you know, total shallow. It's just because I like the color combo or I liked how it looked on the mannequin. I had no clue, like, well, do you know how to dress yourself? Or do you know, like, what you need? Where what feels comfortable on you? You know, what's complimentary to your skin tone, to the way you perceive yourself, to your you know, so all of that.

Debra Coleman [00:20:21]:
I didn't really appreciate that till I was, like, well into adulthood. So that's another reason why I'm very excited to have this conversation because we're not alone in our thinking. Like, I think there's a lot of people who struggle with that. But, so if I'm not mistaken again, I believe boutique box focuses on hell on as well as many wonderful, things. They help us find, and I take this right from your website, perfect 12 pieces that fit and empower. So talk to us about that perfect 12 pieces, philosophy because what is it not like the clause like, the 10 closets full of clothes and, like, I have 50 of this blouse. I have 20 pairs of jeans. I have it's the it's like I've heard that philosophy too.

Debra Coleman [00:21:01]:
It's almost like the reverse pyramid. Like, no. Find certain pieces that you can mix and match that make work for you and then so talk to us about that philosophy of, like, the perfect pieces that fit and empower.

catherine cassidy [00:21:13]:
Yes. Absolute. Well and so when I started YouStyle, my first offering was closet sessions naturally, you know, getting into the closet and clearing it out, what works, how do we play with pieces. And so that's really what led me to a lot of my style philosophy. I have learned through working with each and every single one of my clients over the years. You know, where is she getting stuck? What is the support that she needs? What are the question that she's having? You know, and just how do I, again, make it easier for her to see these things for herself? Well, something that I have believed forever, and even for myself, even going back to, I think, you know, when I transferred from Catholic school to public school in 5th grade, so I had no clothes. And my mom, I asked her, I was like, did you give this to me because did you give me a style allowance because I was annoying to shop for? And she's like, well, I wouldn't have used that word, but, yes, she would have been kinder perhaps. But that's essentially what it was.

catherine cassidy [00:22:23]:
So, you know, it was a $300 a season allowance back in the nineties to start building a wardrobe. Okay. But I have always made sure that I had wardrobe. Okay. But I have always made sure that I had pieces that I really loved that, and I wore them often, and I would be sad when they would wear out. Again, quality of clothes in the nineties and the early 2000s was different than now for mass manufactured pieces. But the idea of 12 perfect pieces is that you do not need a giant wardrobe to have a great wardrobe. You need a wardrobe full of clothes that fit, that you know you love, that you can easily play with so that each piece that you add can immediately create 10, 15 new outfits.

catherine cassidy [00:23:12]:
And maybe the most immediate is 3. But over time, you're finding all these different ways to play with the pieces that you already have. And you said it, mix and match and maximize. So it's super common. I think the biggest reason why people end up having like 2 or 3 closets full of clothes is there's events that they're getting ready for. And so they go to the store and they buy off the mannequin, which is like you have to take care of yourself and you need to you need the solution to the problem in that moment. But my philosophy is if you have this closet that you've intentionally curated, and especially if you can have this, the support in doing this where you're not doing it yourself, and especially if you don't enjoy doing it for yourself, there's no shame in not enjoying it. Although society might, you know, make wanna make you feel otherwise.

Debra Coleman [00:24:03]:
Yeah.

catherine cassidy [00:24:04]:
I am saying there's no shame if you don't enjoy it. But even if you don't enjoy it, every woman wants to feel incredible. Every woman wants to feel her best. Every woman wants to, you know, make a statement when she enters the room, especially for all the right reasons because we we need to be noticed to make an impact. But you, you know, over time, playing with these pieces and and being intentional with what you add, you will not have the overwhelm. You will have better quality pieces, and they don't have to be expensive. Better quality doesn't necessarily mean designer price points. But they may be a little bit more expensive than what you're someone's currently investing in clothes.

catherine cassidy [00:24:49]:
But if you look at it with a return on wear perspective, cost per wear perspective, if you've had something for, you know, 5 years that you've worn even just once a month, and it was 150 versus the $40 top that you only get to wear 5 times, you know, you're getting a much higher return on wear for that $150 piece versus the $40 piece, not to mention you're not having to buy it again. You don't feel the need to buy something to replace it or like you don't have you're missing something in your wardrobe, because you bought something that when you have that event come up, you're like, oh, I'm gonna wear this. I get to wear this. I'm excited to wear this.

Debra Coleman [00:25:32]:
Mhmm. Mhmm. Absolutely. Absolutely. I I know there's been things in my closet that are a higher price point or maybe a designer brand. I remember this Esprit. Remember Esprit

catherine cassidy [00:25:45]:
back in the day? Oh my gosh. Yes.

Debra Coleman [00:25:47]:
I love yeah. I love Esprit. I love everything about them, like the ads, like so I had this Espri sundress that I only wore, you know, like you said, a few times, but it held up for years. It was like, yeah, it was like, at the time, probably out of my price point, you know, as a young person, like, working and part time and everything. But, man, that day I mean, that's just a really, you know, silly example, but it's true. You know? I mean, I mean, there's a reason why people have Levi's for, like, years year decades. Yeah. Yeah.

Debra Coleman [00:26:15]:
They're a little expensive, but they hold up like what they used to anyway. I don't know if the quality has gone down at all, but still, I get it. Yeah. I love that point. Absolutely. Yeah. So yeah. So less is more.

Debra Coleman [00:26:27]:
Less can actually be more for you. And Yep. I love that you also pointed out overwhelm. I mean, we've all seen it, like, on movies and TV shows. You know, the woman opens up her closets, like, you know, a football field. You know? It's like, I have nothing to wear. You know? That's because you where do you even begin? Like, I would I probably wouldn't know what to wear either if I had so much in front of me personally that would, like, I can't. But 12 p or not 12 specifically, but, like, a smaller closet with key pieces that I can mix and match.

Debra Coleman [00:26:55]:
I love that you said mix, match, and maximize. Underscore too is just the

catherine cassidy [00:27:05]:
12 pieces is really, like, that's inclusive of accessories, shoes, belts, tops, dresses, a special occasion piece, and it's year over year, but adding to your wardrobe. So, you know, I it's not necessarily capsule wardrobe because the thought is is that and is, like, even within the boutique box membership, you know, we'll have you create your profile, and then we start helping you find pieces that really take you to the next level. And the vision is that with each piece that you buy through Boutiquebox, it really is helping you embody that next level, and you are playing with that one piece at a time with the pieces that you already have. But then we also walk you through an intelligent style evolution, process where we're guiding you to get into your closet and create more clarity over time, clearing those things out. But the point is is that everything that you need, like, everything starts in your closet. Your evolution starts in your closet. It doesn't start with a complete transformation and a whole new wardrobe. There are so many great things in your closet already.

catherine cassidy [00:28:12]:
There's some pieces that maybe are like learning pieces. They didn't quite work, but you tried them for a reason. So that can give you really good data points about what you wanted to bring into your closet that you were trying to with that piece. So we're we're wanting to capture those details because that helps us guide to the piece that will actually be the you know, that idea that you had with the piece that you haven't worn and and isn't something you should keep because we can't quite make it work. But the idea of it, that tells us, okay. Well, here's the one that gives you that idea, but it's this style. You know, it's the fit that works for you. It's the fabric that works for you.

catherine cassidy [00:28:46]:
It's the color that works for you and those sorts of things. So, it all starts in your closet, and you do need more than just a capsule wardrobe. Most of us do. But the beauty of like the work from home and the pandemic is that it really gives you that space to build your wardrobe intentionally over time versus where we were at before with going into the office every day. You know, you did feel that urgent need to have a lot of things and to wear something different every day and all of that. So I feel like we have, we have a lot more space for, as they're calling it these days, slow fashion, versus the fast fashion, but it is a bit of a retraining and a and a relearning and probably even just reimagining of, like, what it is that, you know, starting with, like, what do I even want?

Debra Coleman [00:29:36]:
I love that. What do I even want? Exactly. Moving away from what we're told we should be wearing or what we need to be wearing or in focusing more on, well, how what makes me happy? What brings me joy? What makes me feel comfortable in my own skin? And then how do I want to, like, be perceived or how do I want to, like, represent myself through what I'm wearing? You know, it really kinda speaks to everything you said. What the one thing that kept kind of resonating with me was you're you're offering back control to us, to your client or to the consumers. Like, okay. You actually do have control over what you wear, and you're not doing everything wrong. You're doing some things right. I love that you pointed that out.

Debra Coleman [00:30:19]:
Like, well, maybe that wasn't that particular piece, but we see what you're after. Like, you're after that certain look or that feel or that style or that cut, you know, whatever. I like that. It it's very nonthreatening. Very like, let's you know what? We're in this together. Let's figure it out, and it's gonna be it's gonna be really fun when we get there. You know? So yeah. I love that.

Debra Coleman [00:30:39]:
Oh, now you also boutique box also really focuses on, or has made, I should say, a commitment to sustainability, by not holding inventory, and partnering, I believe, with emerging brands that, also value quality over quantity as we've been talking about. Now speak to us, why is that approach so important? Because we don't really often hear sustainability in fashion, like, at least, you know, Joe Public doesn't really maybe, like, understand that too too clearly. So what is that importance, and how does it benefit, like, both the consumers and the designers if we lean in towards that?

catherine cassidy [00:31:18]:
The fashion industry is I don't believe it's the number one. It might be. It's at least the number 2 contributor to global warming.

Debra Coleman [00:31:27]:
Wow.

catherine cassidy [00:31:28]:
And there's actually a really there's a company called the Business of Fashion, and the founder, Imran Ahmed, who is kind of also a fashion outsider coming from consulting rather than the fashion industry. So thinking about it more from a business perspective versus a, you know, the fashion industry is about trends. The fashion industry is about more. The fashion industry is about fitting in. I don't fully resonate with the fashion industry myself. I have never really fit in. For me, style has always been a tool to embolden myself as I put myself outside of my comfort zone, starting with that first time I moved in 5th grade because I actually moved twice, so I was a new girl twice. Oh.

catherine cassidy [00:32:14]:
And then when I went to college, I was I no one from my high school went to college where I went 2,000 miles away from home, moving across the country or even just starting my first business. It was not my network were not my clients with when I started my first business. So for me, style has been that tool to put myself in situations where I knew I needed to be, but I was not until I put myself in it, until I wasn't comfortable, it emboldened me. So as that relates to the fashion industry and slow fashion and sustainability, like, as I shared earlier, what I saw with my first jobs were this growth at all costs, scale, you know, essentially the industry running and surviving on economies of scale. You still see this with Macy's and Bloomingdale's, all both whose businesses are, and you know, all the department stores have been, if you follow the business of fashion, but even if you go in as a customer and you just feel like everything's always on sale or the overwhelm every or if you go into different department stores, you see that everything looks the same. Like, there's not this interest in the customer. There's this there's the interest in the business. There's the interest in the trends.

catherine cassidy [00:33:29]:
There's always, always more. So, you know, Zara, Shein might get, you know, a bad rap for being fast fashion, but these mass manufacturers, these mass sales stores are just as much at fault for all of the waste and overproduction in the fashion industry. Because as to the stat as I shared with the 30% of you know, 30% saw through being a best seller, those were just a handful of pieces for a collection. Sometimes just 1 or

Debra Coleman [00:34:03]:
2 out

catherine cassidy [00:34:03]:
of 50 that will come into a store in a in a delivery, which was monthly when I was at BCBG. Now things have changed. It's not always monthly anymore. Different brands have different patterns. But, you know, so 30 to 50% is not even being bought. So it's not even the customers who are contributing to the waste with the pieces that they buy and then end up donating, which may or may not get to somebody who can actually wear them or may or may not even be in in a state to be worn again. So there's just so many contributing factors to the waste and in the fashion industry starting with the overproduction. It all starts with the overproduction and not paying attention to where the customer's needs actually are.

catherine cassidy [00:34:50]:
And, so it's going to take a lot of courageous action from the fashion industry at large, if they're even willing to take this, to be willing to shrink their businesses to grow their profitability. So my point of view is and a lot of this is because and this is even actually why I shifted from YouStyle to Boutique Box back in 2018. As I saw this shift with Shopify launching, that gave brands a path to own their their their customer relationship. There's a whole other conversation I could be having about there's a lot we could talk about with the business of fashion, but, you know, it's the designer owning the conversation with their their customer is so, so important and also so, so hard Yeah. To build a business that can take care of you, can take care of yourself, can take care of the customer. So on the one hand, Shopify created this platform for brands to have this direct relationship and this direct conversation, and and where brands don't have to have the extra markup that you're seeing at department stores. So they can have what I call is a price quality match because they're not there's not that extra markup for that wholesale component. And and so since 28 well, really since, like, I would say 2015, even 2012.

catherine cassidy [00:36:25]:
But with Shopify giving brands this platform, now I see I saw this opportunity, and I still see this opportunity to flip the model where I don't think we can get the big massive brands to change their behavior. As much as the customer owns, is in the driver's seat of driving what these brands can and will do because you're the only reason why they exist. Yeah. What we what I see as the future is that we have to flip the model. We have to give these smaller brands a path to scale sustainably, and that means intelligently with with boutique box, we can leverage what we know about who are our customer bases and help the brands to design to be inclusive in size and style and color and lifestyle, as well as, intelligent in how many pieces we should be designing in these different different styles so that they're not overproducing, so that they can reach a 100% sell through for everything that they create. And these are pieces that will last and stand the test of time. And if they're creating like that, they'll have profitable business. I can't speak right now.

catherine cassidy [00:37:39]:
Profitable businesses that, that they can grow, and and they have a a really strong foundation to stay in business and own the narrative for how they want their businesses to grow and what their businesses stand for.

Debra Coleman [00:37:55]:
It sounds like it can be a real win win for both sides of the Absolutely. Mhmm. As well as for our environment and our

catherine cassidy [00:38:03]:
Absolutely.

Debra Coleman [00:38:04]:
Yeah. Yeah. What is it called? The the the footprint? Mhmm. Your footprint that you leave. It just lost it just left my brain.

catherine cassidy [00:38:12]:
Not Yep. The carbon footprint.

Debra Coleman [00:38:14]:
Thank you. Yes. Exactly. Right. Wow. Exactly. And is Boutique Box, would you say, sort of a bridge between those 2?

catherine cassidy [00:38:23]:
They can be. Okay. We partner I I would say, like, we don't partner with brands specifically because they're sustainably minded. Mhmm. Unfortunately, right now, most, like, sustainability first brands are too casual for getting dressed for work.

Debra Coleman [00:38:38]:
Okay.

catherine cassidy [00:38:38]:
But I do believe that the biggest thing that we can do is be mindful of the fabrics, and the longevity for how long we're able to wear the clothes so that they're not ending up in landfills. And and, you know, again, with with the sell through component because, you know, so much of that that that imprint, that carbon footprint is the clothes that are never purchased. And all of all of the water usage, the chemicals, the supply chain logistics for product that never ends up being sold.

Debra Coleman [00:39:12]:
It's like, are we going to have to go back to Little House on Prairie days? Okay. Y'all learn how to sew, learn how to make your own, make dresses out of our curtains. I mean, you know, that's extreme, but still, it just makes you wonder. You know, every time you kind of like, we have talked about earlier, you buy that, you know, $20 blouse that, okay, after maybe a month or 2 doesn't fit anymore, starting to wear down or the the seams are coming undone. I'm just gonna toss it.

catherine cassidy [00:39:37]:
Mhmm.

Debra Coleman [00:39:37]:
Wow. Think about that though on a larger scale with just tossing that. Yeah. And how it even got into your hands in the 1st place, what it cost our environment to get there.

catherine cassidy [00:39:46]:
Yeah.

Debra Coleman [00:39:46]:
Yeah. Interesting.

catherine cassidy [00:39:48]:
And and that's not to, like, shame anybody. Like, it is No. It is what it is. Sure. Like Sure. It's the I think the number one thing that you can do for the environment to be more sustainable as your style is to wear what you have.

Debra Coleman [00:40:04]:
Mhmm.

catherine cassidy [00:40:05]:
Exactly. And so that's where the know, 12 to 15 pieces a year comes from. That's where the ethos of quality over quantity really, and and mixing and matching. And but it it it takes a little bit of courage even from you as the customer to say, okay, I am gonna make sure that I only have a closet full of clothes that I wear. Because it takes a bit of a time investment up front to be able to save yourself that time, energy, and money over the long run.

Debra Coleman [00:40:34]:
Yes. Absolutely agree. Absolutely. I know for me now, I think I'm finally at a point where I have a little, maybe a teaspoon of that. If I go to look for something new, then and, like, okay. I really want you know, I'm really into athleisure wear. So, like, okay. I really want, like, the hot Lyoto pants.

Debra Coleman [00:40:50]:
What does that okay. Well, what else can I wear? Like, I asked myself, what else can I wear them with or how else can I wear them? There's, like, a secondary conversation going on with myself. Like, well, before you just hit buy or pick that up off the rack, what else can you do with this that you are that you already have? What other pieces can you wear with this? Just because I wanna be more intentional with what I fill my closet with and really start to wear what I love when I go through my and I'm like, I put little outfits together that I never really thought of before just because I maybe heard somebody or saw somebody else wearing it. And I'm like, I never thought to blend those 2 fabrics together. What a great idea. I have that, you know, and now I just created a new outfit in my closet that I didn't even think about before. So

catherine cassidy [00:41:32]:
Exactly.

Debra Coleman [00:41:33]:
Yeah. I love that. Yeah. I love it. But for those of us that need a little help or a gentle guidance in that in that area, this is where Boutique Box proudly steps in to help us, you know, get to that point where we have the same sort of thrill ride when we open up our closet doors and say, yeah. I worked with Boutique Box. This is what I've created, or I am in the process of creating, and I love getting dressed for work every day, whether it be home or out of office, you know, in office or out of office, or even on the weekends. You know? I mean, all that comes into play.

Debra Coleman [00:42:00]:
I love it. Yeah. Love it. Wow. As you said, we could I mean, my gosh. I I could continue to ask you questions about fashion. It's just it's so fascinating to me. It really is.

Debra Coleman [00:42:13]:
It's just there's so much going on behind it, you know, that we just don't under. We don't get unless we're like you, unless we're in the industry itself. So I thank you for sharing a little bit of more about Boutique Box and what, what you offer and your reasons for creating it. And then also just giving us permission to to question that and to and to be proud of what we have already, but then be open to exploring other ways of going about, maybe obtaining new pieces or or repurposing what we have. I just love that you've sort of given us that permission to have those conversations with ourselves or with experts such as yours yourself and your team.

catherine cassidy [00:42:49]:
That's what it's for. That's what that's that's the way we move it forward. So thank you.

Debra Coleman [00:42:54]:
Oh, you're welcome. As one, you know, 8 late eighties, early nineties fashion gal to another, I gotcha. And let me just the asterisk. It was Robinson's May is where I worked. It was not

catherine cassidy [00:43:05]:
Macy's. It was yes.

Debra Coleman [00:43:07]:
At the mall. Yeah. Yep. Yep. Robinson's May in the juniors department. Yeah. Uh-huh. Oh

catherine cassidy [00:43:12]:
my gosh.

Debra Coleman [00:43:12]:
Yeah. I was

catherine cassidy [00:43:14]:
So it did become Macy's, though. So

Debra Coleman [00:43:17]:
Yes.

catherine cassidy [00:43:17]:
Yeah. That's that's what people I think well, you know, this is 1,005, 2006 when that merger happened. So

Debra Coleman [00:43:24]:
Yeah.

catherine cassidy [00:43:26]:
Most unless you're on the West Coast, most people don't know Robinson's May.

Debra Coleman [00:43:29]:
So Right. That's right. Let me tell you, my very first, though, retail job was with Miller's Outpost.

catherine cassidy [00:43:35]:
Oh my god.

Debra Coleman [00:43:36]:
Do you remember Miller's Outpost?

catherine cassidy [00:43:37]:
I don't. Well, I actually wasn't so I didn't grow up in the I grew up in the Midwest. So if it was a California or Midwest

Debra Coleman [00:43:43]:
Okay.

catherine cassidy [00:43:44]:
That's

Debra Coleman [00:43:44]:
why. Okay. Yeah. But yeah. No. Then then thought I was, like, all that and a bag of chips and transitioned into the mall to Robinsons, May. I'm like, look at me. I'm going places.

Debra Coleman [00:43:54]:
I'm a mall rat now. I'm working for Robinsons May. Look out world. You know, that kind of thing. So yeah. Yes. Wow. Oh, I love it.

Debra Coleman [00:44:02]:
Wow. Well, I really appreciate this conversation, Catherine, so much. Thank you. And if my listeners are interested in learning more about Boutique Box, where can they find you and learn more?

catherine cassidy [00:44:13]:
Please, I would love to connect. Go to yourboutiqueboxdot com. There is a little get started button, so I would encourage you to sign up to keep in touch. And I send a style memo every Friday that is really designed to inspire and shift you until you're ready to join the membership. I would love to have you become a member and be supported in that way, but I know we're all on different parts of our journey and our relationship with style and our career. And then, I would love to connect on Instagram or LinkedIn. It's Your Boutique Box for all of our socials as well. So, and I'm always, always listening.

catherine cassidy [00:44:54]:
So when I ask questions in our newsletter or our on our social, I genuinely would love to hear from you because it helps me know how we can help you.

Debra Coleman [00:45:05]:
So I love that. Oh, you really do have Katherine's ear. She really is listening. Oh, I love that. Thank you for adding that. And I will absolutely add all of those links in the show notes. So I I encourage you to check out the show notes to connect with Boutique Box. And let me let me just say, I love the style blog.

Debra Coleman [00:45:22]:
I think it is incredibly incredibly relevant, and it just it's very conversational, and it just gets right to the heart of some of those topics. So bravo on the style blog on your website. Very well done.

catherine cassidy [00:45:34]:
Thank you. Yeah. Very well done. 16 years of hard won effort. Wow. Hard won wisdom, I should say.

Debra Coleman [00:45:41]:
It totally shows. Absolutely. Yes. It's just a beautifully designed website all around. So, absolutely, friends. Check that out in the show notes. Absolutely. So well, before I let you hop, miss Catherine, and get back to your your day, do you have time for one more silly bonus question? Absolutely.

Debra Coleman [00:46:00]:
Okay. Alrighty. Well, as clearly demonstrated, you are a busy lady. You have you're running a company. You have a lot to do. It you know, we found time to meet today, and I'm sure when we hop off here, you have a a plate full of other things things to get to accomplish before the sun goes down. But when life gets crazy and is pulling Catherine in 10 different directions, what do you do to help you reset and rebalance and help you refocus and just kinda bring it back to ground 0 so you can then continue on living your best life and doing all the wonderful things for Boutique Box and your clients?

catherine cassidy [00:46:37]:
That is a great question. Early on in my business, I realized that I was you know, one of the reasons for starting my own business was so that I had autonomy over my time and and my life and creating freedom. One of the reasons why I focused on professional women is because at the time at 25, I was like, I don't wanna be at that level and a mom. It was how do I have a career that I want and be a mom? Now 16 years later, I do not have children, but I still think about, you know, I'm building this for myself. I'm building this so that my time and how I spend it is exactly how I wanna spend it. So that being said, I had no money at the beginning stages of my business. So it wasn't like I had freedom to spend money on things, but I did have my freedom of my time. So self care is something that I built into my life very intentionally.

catherine cassidy [00:47:53]:
Because so that I can make sure that I fill my my bucket first. And how I fill my bucket is if I'm moving through something, giving myself that space to think it all the way through, literally sit and stare at the wall, do a meditation. I love EFT as a way to move through, and I have other modalities I'd be happy to share around, like, shifting the energy around challenges that I'm facing. And then I also love to do things with friends that get me out of my body and out of my comfort zone. I've always been very, very active, so working out is key to my mental health and my self care, and helps me get grounded again. And then more recently, and I share this for anybody who's really, truly wanting to get out of their comfort zone and maybe isn't ready to jump out of a plane, which I did do for my 18th birthday. Wow, yeah. But I discovered trapeze.

catherine cassidy [00:48:56]:
So if you have the opportunity to take a trapeze class and you like things like skiing and stuff like that, you will it is like the I love doing those things because they get me it's like a combination of all the things that I love, spending quality time with friends, you know, getting challenging myself, getting myself out of my comfort zone, getting better as I do something, as I, you know, make mistakes and learn and iterate. And I get to do something that creates an indoor you know, adrenaline rush.

Debra Coleman [00:49:28]:
I'll say. I'll say for sure. So, you know,

catherine cassidy [00:49:35]:
center of it all is, like, just what in this moment is going to give me my you know, give me good energy and help me recenter, and there's a lot of different ways to do that. But but, yeah, being active and and spending time with people that that get me, I think, is number 1.

Debra Coleman [00:49:54]:
Love that. Absolutely. Active and spending time with people who get you. I mean, that's a such a wonderful combination. And flying through the air with the greatest of ease, like, on your trapeze. That's amazing. Oh, my goodness. I would try it because I tried, what's it called? Zip lining? And I just going through the air, like, up above everybody, that's just that's it was just a thrill.

Debra Coleman [00:50:17]:
So Oh,

catherine cassidy [00:50:18]:
my god. You will absolutely love it.

Debra Coleman [00:50:20]:
Alright. You've sold me. I'm like, totally. I might be screaming the whole time, like, carry it. But I would, like, secretly be loving it.

catherine cassidy [00:50:26]:
Yeah. I wish that they had recorded the first time I jumped because I definitely screamed. And the friends who I was with were like, we were not expecting that from you because I can be a little stoic sometimes, but, you know.

Debra Coleman [00:50:45]:
Oh. Well, Catherine, once again, wow. Thank you for such a great conversation and really opening our eyes up to fashion and sustainability and just being accepting of our own style choices, our own body, and knowing that your firm, boutique box, is there to help us bridge that gap in between finding those pieces and feeling comfortable with what we're wearing and proud to open up our closet every day.

catherine cassidy [00:51:08]:
Thank you so much. I appreciate this. And just what a beautiful what a beautiful platform you've built. So thank you.

Debra Coleman [00:51:17]:
Well, my friend, that wraps up my enlightening conversation with Catherine Cassidy, founder and CEO of Boutique Fox. I hope you found her insights on sustainable fashion, empowering women through their wardrobe choice choices, and celebrating our unique styles as inspiring as I did. Don't forget to check out the show notes for links to learn more about boutique box and learn how Katherine is continuing to revolutionize fashion. You'll find ways to connect with her and explore her amazing work. Thank you so much for joining me on this episode of Have A Seat. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to also check out that additional link in the show notes that will take you directly to the Have A Seat website where you will find more amazing conversations just like this with women in the workplace who are killing it in their specific game. Alright. Well, as always, my beautiful friend, stay safe, be well, and remember, keep having those conversations.

Debra Coleman [00:52:14]:
Until next week.